halp plz

[Poodle]

Tom's HDi - sorry, SAM's HDi - is definitely broken, Tom even says so himself, but admitting that here would mean he would carry absolutely no weight in this argument at all. Oh wait...

[C.A.R.]

For f*ck sake you dopey bellend, it's a 10-year-old car and 50mpg back then was fantastic - it still is today!

For someone with very little experience of different cars and having never owned a powerful petrol car you don't half go on like you know what you're talking about.

The 306 with a 2.0 HDi engine is more than adequate for any daily commute and the only reason you couldn't overtake two cyclists at once is due to a mental fault - of your own.

Jesus tittyf*cking christ this is like trying to teach ants to swim.

[Niall]

Chris, i know tom can be pretty persistent with his views which are probably completely different to most of us but theres no need to get offensive with your argument. End of the day, its only an opinion which everyones entitled to.

[Eeyore]

just read this thread. All i have to add is that my hdi is awesome btw.

[Toms306]

Tom's HDi - sorry, SAM's HDi - is definitely broken, Tom even says so himself, but admitting that here would mean he would carry absolutely no weight in this argument at all. Oh wait...

Turns out it isn't broken though! I assumed there must have been a major boost leak or something......but there isn't one at all! Yes the EML is on but the code is the CKP so nothing really fuel related as it can use the cps for timing instead. So it isn't broken afterall, must just be crap as standard lol.


Chris....the silver golf was a 51 plate, 11 years old....if that had only done 50mpg even after 10 years and 140k miles I'd think it was broken.....infact it was still doing 55mpg with a hole in the intetcooler lol, if vag can manage mpg 10 years ago, why not Pug?

As for that particular overtake which was this morning, I booted it from 20 in 3rd, nothing happened to note so I dropped into 2nd, revved its tits off and still barely got anywhere, well there's not a gear between those so what else could I have done? I'm not sure if its the tiny turbo or shit gearing but it just doesn't shift when you need it to. Granted it'll sit at 60 in 5th all day if that's what you do...but that isn't the sort of driving I do most of the time.

The anti stall seems to be shite too for a diesel, I don't remember stalling the golf. And I never even stalled the petrol Avensis with the fluctuating idle, yet I've stalled the hdi three times now!! What's up with that! I'm hoping its just due to the new clutch though, and the fact we didn't change the fork bushes....really regret that now as the clutch isnt smooth at slow speed, that parts our fault though, not the cars obviously.

[Poodle]

Tom i wasn't joking, from all your descriptions that car sounds like it's broken. I mean, stalling it? Really? Definitely very broken. Tbf i have managed this once myself, but it was before i passed my test, on the day i first bought the car, i was in third instead of first....

[C.A.R.]

Never stalled my HDi Tom, in fact can't remember the last time I stalled a car when it wasn't deliberate!

Are you moaning about 306 HDi's in general or just the example that you have begrudgingly borrowed from an understanding mate?

On the whole there's nothing wrong with a 306 HDi - they're simple motoring. They won't do 60mpg and they're not as fast as a Golf but then they are vastly less complicated! And if they do go wrong they're cheap to fix; I'm not sure what more someone could want?!

[Niall]

tom just because theres no code associated to fueling doesnt mean its not broken. Codes mean f*ck all really in real garages. there just a vague idea of what is wrong

[Toms306]

Tom i wasn't joking, from all your descriptions that car sounds like it's broken. I mean, stalling it? Really? Definitely very broken. Tbf i have managed this once myself, but it was before i passed my test, on the day i first bought the car, i was in third instead of first....

I think the stalling is due to the clutch/fork bushes as said, but still shouldn't stall that easy in a derv, pulled away a few times in third in the golf accidentally lol, but the clutch was much smoother and it wouldn't stall unless you dropped the clutch in 6th lol. What can be broken to make it underfuel or not avoid stalling though? Idled rough in the cold too....might be something to do with it?

Never stalled my HDi Tom, in fact can't remember the last time I stalled a car when it wasn't deliberate!

Are you moaning about 306 HDi's in general or just the example that you have begrudgingly borrowed from an understanding mate?

On the whole there's nothing wrong with a 306 HDi - they're simple motoring. They won't do 60mpg and they're not as fast as a Golf but then they are vastly less complicated! And if they do go wrong they're cheap to fix; I'm not sure what more someone could want?!

Bit of both lol, I can see this isn't a perfect hdi, but I also can't see anything that would stand out as making them particularly good on any other one. If the next one I get is cheap tax, reliable, fast enough to live with and good on fuel I'll retract my previous statements about them, but I don't think it'll happen somehow.

Plus simplicity isn't always best - I need a CV boot on the hdi, that means draining 15 quid of gearbox oil! Shafts are bolted in on the pd, no oil loss, cheaper job! . And have you done anything with the hdi? There's no space at all, god knows what we'd do if the boost pipe broke, there's not enough space to get to it! Atleast there's easy access in the golf lol, can have my bumper, all boost pipes and the ic out and back in under half hour lol.

tom just because theres no code associated to fueling doesnt mean its not broken. Codes mean f*ck all really in real garages. there just a vague idea of what is wrong

Have youo been in a real garage? First thing they do with an EML fault is plug them in lol....then check autodata/manufacturer diag tool for ideas on what to do about the problem. Thankfully they don't need to do hours of checking everything with multimeters any more, that's kinda the point of the standard obd stuff.

[Niall]

Yes Tom a lot more than you probably think. Yes I know they do but say for example you get a injector fault. A mechanic won't just go straight to stores and pick up a new injector. There could be loads of reasons why it doesn't work!

[Toms306]

With an injector fault obviousl the code would tell you which one and the fault with it. Then autodata would tell you what to test with your multimeter, but you said if there's no fuelling fault it can still be broken, but it can't really unless its something mechanical that's failed. That said, I never saw a multimeter the entire time I was at fords, its cheaper for them to swap parts in (not always right first time though) than it is to get thier auto electrician on it with his hourly rate. I was really surprised tbh in the real world they do just guess and whack parts in these days, rather than fannying around with multimeters which is what we'd spent so much time at college doing.

[Niall]

With an injector fault obviousl the code would tell you which one and the fault with it. Then autodata would tell you what to test with your multimeter, but you said if there's no fuelling fault it can still be broken, but it can't really unless its something mechanical that's failed. That said, I never saw a multimeter the entire time I was at fords, its cheaper for them to swap parts in (not always right first time though) than it is to get thier auto electrician on it with his hourly rate. I was really surprised tbh in the real world they do just guess and whack parts in these days, rather than fannying around with multimeters which is what we'd spent so much time at college doing.

This just shows Tom that you've never worked as a proper mechanic. You can't beat the, what is now the old fashion method of working out faults manually instead of plugging a computer in and going "yeah it could be that" or just replacing things you think it could be until it finally works.

[C.A.R.]

Does Tom know that once upon a time not so long ago there were cars driving around which had no diagnostic port?!

The horror!

[Toms306]

This just shows Tom that you've never worked as a proper mechanic. You can't beat the, what is now the old fashion method of working out faults manually instead of plugging a computer in and going "yeah it could be that" or just replacing things you think it could be until it finally works.

Most garages don't have 'proper' mechanics any more. Takes too much time and ups labour costs for the customer!! I'm sure there are a few that still use the old method, but not at main dealers....at Ford for example, everything went through the Ford main database thing for warranty work, this basically means the tech's have to do exactly what the computer tells them to do, even if they know its not right and theres a simple common fix that can be done!! And I was surprised when my local garage said about the Golf....'oh, we stuck it on the code reader and no faults came up....probably the DMF!' despite the fact it was the wrong end of the engine lol.

'Mechanics' is changing....as I've said before, we werent even shown the old stuff like a VE pump at college, pretty much everything we did involved the scan tool and a multimeter.

Does Tom know that once upon a time not so long ago there were cars driving around which had no diagnostic port?!

The horror!

Funny thing is we're way behind America for OBD, all their cars were compliant from about '96 IIRC! Europe finally caught up and made it so all cars had to be complaint in '01 for petrol and '04 for diesel....but it is a labour saving system, the whole idea of of it is to reduce time and costs.....so why would you totally ignore it??

[Niall]

Don't agree there Tom. I know that Jaguar still have their master technicians who work the old fashion ways because its better, quicker and saves money. I know what you mean though....cars are changing to just plug a laptop in and away you go but when that fails, you have to go back to old fashion methods. Sounds like your course wasn't really worth shit to me!

[C.A.R.]

I would have far more confidence in a mechanic who was competant enough to diagnose a fault or at least narrow it down without first having to plug their iPhone into the cars OBD port...

[Toms306]

Don't agree there Tom. I know that Jaguar still have their master technicians who work the old fashion ways because its better, quicker and saves money. I know what you mean though....cars are changing to just plug a laptop in and away you go but when that fails, you have to go back to old fashion methods. Sounds like your course wasn't really worth shit to me!

Fair enough, I've never been to Jaguar so i wouldn't know...but certainly the cheaper manufacturers are like that, ford, citroen, pug etc.

The course was a bit odd, but the idea of it is to get you a wide range of knowledge ready for an apprenticeship where you learn more of the 'hands on' stuff. I'm not actually qualified to work in a garage before the NVQ which is gained via an apprenticeship. But I learnt a lot of extra bits that others didnt as believe it or not I was one of the best in the workshop lol (I know, I didnt believe it either ) so often helped out with variuos things that werent in our schedule that the other techs/groups were doing..............still never saw a VE pump though lol!

Must admit, I don't think the course covered enough physical stuff, although it covered a hell of a lot of theory stuff. But then one of the reasons of the breaking the Golf instead of selling it whole is to learn more about it, it's gonna sell for peanuts either way, might as well get something useful from it..........I'd also never done a clutch before me and Sam gave it a go on the estate!!

---

I would have far more confidence in a mechanic who was competant enough to diagnose a fault or at least narrow it down without first having to plug their iPhone into the cars OBD port...

I'm sure you would...but do you ever see the mechanics at the main dealers? No they hide them out the back, you just speak to some nice bird on the counter! I do agree with you, and obviously you can usually 'guess' where a problem lies - part of the course was fault finding, but you had scenarios like a MAF which won't bring up a fualt code.....or swapping injectors over to make sure you can prove which one is at fault. However you still HAD to try the scan tool first lol, lost marks if not.

Plus, iPhone would be cheaper....couldn't believe how much the Snap On Solus costs to buy!! Is fun to play with though.

[Niall]

Snap on kit is fooking expensive but well worth the money especially if your a mechanic by trade. I've got a snapon flexi ratchet that's older than me that my old man bought when he first started out. Still works fine!

It's a shame though that people like you are going on these courses and their not teaching you the real job. I bet not a single person on that course could do a cambelt change confidently without first having to plug in a computer just to see if a change has already been logged. Shame proper mechanics in little grubby garages are becoming extinct because "everything can be fixed via a obd port"which just isn't true.

[C.A.R.]

Tom I think you're missing the point a bit too.

Who takes their car to a main dealer for repair? Typically the cars dealers see are only going to be 5 years old max, so major mechanical problems have yet to occur. This means that the majority of cars can be repaired by plugging them in as it's far more likely an electrical sensor has failed over something mechanical.

If you really want to learn something sensible about mechanics, go an learn it from the kind of garage a sensible person would take their car. ie. not a main dealership.

[Poodle]

Sounds like shagged fuelling from your description fella, probably injectors. Could be the turbo dying, but that doesn't explain the rough idle on cold starts.