Stage 2 remap and stage 1

[Welshy_Pete]

Whats the diffrence between stage 2 remap and stage 1?

Thats if they do both for the 306 hdi.

[padge]

well obviously more power

just a straight forward remap, 120bhp-130bhp.

stage 2 normally consists of an fmic, uprated clutch if you want full blown torque map, and stage 2 software, usually seeing 150-165bhp.

then theres the little things like egr delete and decat/straight through exhaust.

[Poodle]

Just to be clear, stage 2 maps are written onto the same software that stage 1's are, you don't need to change that at all.

I don't know who "they" are, but if they only offer a stage 1 map then i would be wary of the quality of their work, you will often find people who are flogging crap generic maps that they've found somewhere and don't actually know how they work. There's a couple of good mappers on .net - mrwhippy, pro_steve and tb205gti.

Calling them stages is misleading, but the basic gist is this:
- "Stage 1" is just a remap. It will see you go up to 115-120bhp, can get as much as 130 if it's a very good map and you've done some basic supporting mods, such as de-cat, de-backbox, etc.
- "Stage 2" denotes some more extensive supporting mods, as detailed above by Padge. The term "stage 2" is usually associated with breathing-focussed mods, hence fmic, 2.5" straight-through exh, new intake system, hybrid turbo, etc. Again, you would need a new map to take advantage of the new mods.
- "Stage 3" (for anyone interested) would then be the fuelling side of things, so bigger fuel pump, different/modified injectors, higher pressure rail sensor, etc. This is the point at which you might need to think about different software for your ecu, or even a stand-alone management system (I wouldn't say it's necessary, but it's all a matter of preference and opinion). Even if you didn't want to go down that route you would still need another new map to match the mods.

[Welshy_Pete]

Also panel filter or exhaust mods and egr switched of?

Will there be better mpg with a remap or worse?

What sort of exhaust mods backbox alone?

Center box removed?

any of those make a diffrence?

thanks

[Poodle]

EGR won't affect your power unless it's stuck open, if it was me i'd bin it anyway though.

Imho after-market panel filters are a waste of money, but everyone has their own views on that.

Mpg - if you drive it hard it'll use a lot of fuel, if you drive it nicely it won't be any different from before, in fact a lot of people see their every-day mpg go up after a remap.

Exhaust - mid-box is pretty much straight through already, so most people get rid of the back-box and cat and use the mid as their only box. Would advise against spending money on an after-market back-box as they're all designed for petrols so will most likely cost you power.

[Welshy_Pete]

I might get a stange 1 remap done sometime soon. It should pull away alot better and have better mpg if driven normal.

[Mr Whippy]

In driving them you would feel differently, but technically, you will get the biggest boost in power all over the rev range with a stage 1 tune, and all for the lowest outlay in money.

A good way to look at it is this:

Motorway cruising at 60mph in 5th gear, about 2750rpm iirc. At 2750rpm on a standard engine you have about 70bhp at the wheels.

You have about 12bhp loss due to the aero dynamics, you have about 3bhp from tyre drag, so about 15bhp losses.

That means at 60mph in 5th gear on the motorway, you have about 55bhp left to accelerate you forwards.


Once you have remapped the car to stage 1 (basic tune is the best thing to call it), you have more like 90bhp at the wheels at 2750rpm, so with those same losses taken away, you have 75bhp left to accelerate you forwards.

So 75bhp from 55bhp is a 35% improvement in power, which means 35% more acceleration, which is quite a lot really!

And that is the worst case scenario because it's near peak power of the standard car.

The remap to stage 1 adds more power at higher rpm, so in 4th gear at 3000-4000rpm, you have about 50% more acceleration than you do as standard, which is loads more!



So in the worst case, you have about 30% more acceleration, in the best case you have about 60% more acceleration, so lets say on average you will feel it to be about 45% more accelerative!


A stage 2 tune, with the associated intercooler and all the other mechanical work, doesn't offer the same gains from the stage 1 tune. It's close, but when you look at bang per pound, it's nowhere near.

An intercooled HDi though is getting into the realms of a genuinely nippy road car, and they are well worth having a go with! I wish I'd never sold mine now

Dave