Xantia engine questions

[Frosty]

Right so I got a engine out of a xantia that I will be putting in my D turbo after I've rebuilt it etc. Just got a few questions about bits I have come across.

First up it the obvious really when it come to a semi ECU bosch pump that it has. Is it any use at all? Whats different on them to a 'normal' bosch pump?





Next up is the injectors. I haven't actually looked but they must be bosch 1s. So are they just normal bosch 1s? I noticed 1 has a wire coming off it. Whats that for?



This switch for oil pressure?



Think that's it for now. Any help much appreciated

[Jimbo]

Same switch for oil pressure on any dt no??

[Tom]

See people say that the semi ecu engines the advance is changed by the ecu, but that just looks like the ecu monitors throttle position, unless its got something on the back of the pump.

[Frosty]

Same switch for oil pressure on any dt no??

I dunno I cant remember seeing it there before. Been a while since I played with a XUD though. Will look at engine in my dt tomorrow. Im prob just being silly

[Jimbo]

Mines got it mate,

[Frosty]

See people say that the semi ecu engines the advance is changed by the ecu, but that just looks like the ecu monitors throttle position, unless its got something on the back of the pump.

Im not sure. Will have to have more of a look

---

Mines got it mate,

Must be me being silly. Pretty standard lol

[Jimbo]

Can make it out in this picture mate

[padge]

you need to swap the pumps over, im not 100% sure on how the semi ecu advance kinda works, but I know that pump is pretty much worthless

[Frosty]

Yeah I will have a different pump to go on it, just wondered if this 1 is of any use?

[padge]

got any papers you don't want blowing away?

[Chris_90]

got any papers you don't want blowing away?

Sure if you put it on eBay you would get most if the money you paid for engine back

[Frosty]

I could put it on ebay and say its a remapped bosch pump

[Tom]

I could put it on ebay and say its a remapped bosch pump

Haha Must be worth £299.99 atleast!

[Mal]

See people say that the semi ecu engines the advance is changed by the ecu, but that just looks like the ecu monitors throttle position, unless its got something on the back of the pump.

Yeah it measures the throttle position. Pile of wank so it is, the keyed part that moves it loosened on me on the motorway one day, givingit a wrong position and the car wouldn't go atall....

As far as I know, the wire on the injector is to measure the injection rate. Some 406's came with a range estimator and mpg calculator (although I can't be arsed wiring in my one, I lose my epic phone holder if I do). Open to corrections there

When my 406 is back up and running, I'll make a vid of it without the ecu running it. It knocks terribly and is horrid to drive. Don't use this pump on a non ecu car as there is no means of controlling the injection timing

Your oil switch is easily swapped, I've seen 2 different types on the DHX engines (Xantia and 406)

[Martin306]

The semi ECU pump will have a built in immobiliser (yes it's in the pump not the ECU) and an electronic RETARD. it's not an advance uses PCM to control. Full constant 12v is fully retarded, and the "off" pulses get larger to advance. So from that I'd guess it's a solenoid on a spring rather than a servo.

From what I can make out, it only exists to keep the engine quiet and more refined, because it still has the mechanical advance.

to bypass the immobiliser, simply take off the armour, rip out the circuit board and wire the stop solenoid directly. Then it'll work the same as the full "proper" mechanical pumps. So it's not totally useless if you don't want it to be.

Assuming it works the same way as my semi electric Bosch.

[Frosty]

Cheers for the info guys. So could I just cut the wire off the injector and use them as normal if you know what I mean?

[Danny Wideboy]

I have the same injectors in mine. Just cut the wire off, or leave it unplugged.Also a lot of the pump is the same inside so you have a spare LDA pin and governer assembly to play with.

[darrenjlobb]

Those pumps have a solenoid valve on the bottom of the casing, the the reg is set to full pressure, the solenoid then regulates pressure to the timing piston rather than rpm vs case pressure stylye, allowing the ecu to change the dynamic timing. Which is knows by monitoring crank position and the injector needle lift sensor (thats what that wire on 1 injector is).

Unless you run the ecu etc, the pump is useless as will just run static timing, which will be horrific!

[Frosty]

Ok so is the pump any use for spares etc?

[Tom]

Yeah, it must have a gov and vanes and all that jazz still?!

[r3k1355]

Just rip it off and run a normal pump, it's the setup mine is running.

Have you got the auto-adjust aux-belt tensioners as well?

[Chris_90]

Ok so is the pump any use for spares etc?

Probably best to put it on fb with ready to be remapped on the add

[Jimbo]

Ok so is the pump any use for spares etc?

Probably best to put it on fb with ready to be remapped on the add

Haha too funny, waiting for sone idiots to conment, there always is

[Frosty]

Ok so is the pump any use for spares etc?

Probably best to put it on fb with ready to be remapped on the add

Had to be done really for a laugh

[Ruan]

The semi ECU pump will have a built in immobiliser (yes it's in the pump not the ECU) and an electronic RETARD. it's not an advance uses PCM to control. Full constant 12v is fully retarded, and the "off" pulses get larger to advance. So from that I'd guess it's a solenoid on a spring rather than a servo.

From what I can make out, it only exists to keep the engine quiet and more refined, because it still has the mechanical advance.

to bypass the immobiliser, simply take off the armour, rip out the circuit board and wire the stop solenoid directly. Then it'll work the same as the full "proper" mechanical pumps. So it's not totally useless if you don't want it to be.

Assuming it works the same way as my semi electric Bosch.

It is an advance controller, it just so happens that you apply voltage to back off the timing because of the way the pump works, the regulator is just set to maximum pressure and then there's a solenoid valve that is actuated by the ECU that regulates the pressure to the timing piston. It's just that there's multiple inputs into the ECU to regulate what turns on when, so EGR is disabled until the engine heats up, the timing is adjusted dynamically based on temperature at different engine speeds etc.

They also have the wire on the 3rd injector for feedback about needle lift time - that's how it automatically compensates for the "base" timing position on the pump bracket - it knows the crank angle and when the injector fires, so can then precisely control the start of injection (advance..) even if the pump isn't precisely set - up to a point.

And I think you mean PWM - Pulse Width Modulation - PCM is what digital audio in CDs use

Really want to get one apart and read the chips, I bet you could tune them really well - it'd get rid of all the problems that XUDs have when you piss with bigger heads and levers with the advance not coming in at the right time.

[Martin306]

Oh LOL yeah pwm i meant. That advance on my nad is dead, drives ok with static tbh.


Also, it doesn't have a "lift" sensor on any of the injectors :O

[Frosty]

Just rip it off and run a normal pump, it's the setup mine is running.

Have you got the auto-adjust aux-belt tensioners as well?

Yeah it has the auto adjuster. I will be using the ph1 aux set up with the lolly pop tensioner

[r3k1355]

I'm still running the auto-adjuster, squeels abit on cold-start

[Frosty]

Question on the injectors, can i just cut the wire off the injector that has the wire and it be ok to use?

[r3k1355]

I'm pretty sure mine have just had the wiring snipped, I don't know if you've gotta do anything else with the wiring tho.