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+--- Thread: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) (/showthread.php?tid=24914)
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - welshpug - 09-12-2014
that engine is far from light Darren, it weighs more than a 1.9 MI16 and a 2.0 EW, the alloy TU 8v's are a lot lighter.
choccy teapot MA is lighter than a BE though which helps keep the weight less than an XUD I'd imagine.
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - Niall - 09-12-2014
These engines really are bullet proof. You can chuck 300hp down their neck easily without even thinking about forging anything so you could turbo it. I know of a few that were done before or during my 106 days (2007-8) and are still about, as happy as a standard engine.
If you don't want to spend the money on a turbo setup (won't be cheap...my SC project cost £1500ish and that was a fairly cheap build minus the ECU), you could refit the cams and have a map on it if you can find one online or on the forums. The 106gti uses the same 1AP as the gti6 which can be remapped fairly easily with the right kit!
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - Eeyore - 09-12-2014
Wow amazing thst you've got it sorted. I feel so annoyed for you right now. What a choice...
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - Dum-Dum - 09-12-2014
Get it mapped to the cams dude
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - Piggy - 09-12-2014
Just get it mapped surely, even if it was just a fiddle to make it idle.
Or lash up a turbo to it, sure you got some pipework, oil lines and a fmic kicking about and map it for that!
Even at low VERY safe boost, could get 160bhp
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - Niall - 09-12-2014
Tbh on some cams, even with a proper map it will idle like a pig. I don't know much about these cams though so don't know how severe they are.
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - welshpug - 09-12-2014
on a single inlet thats quite true, also the wilder you go the more static compression you need to a certain degree.
ph3's arent particularly wild though, especially if they fit in a stock engine, though I'd bet not many are timed uo on a dti properly.
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - darrenjlobb - 09-12-2014
(09-12-2014, 07:31 PM)welshpug Wrote: that engine is far from light Darren, it weighs more than a 1.9 MI16 and a 2.0 EW, the alloy TU 8v's are a lot lighter.
choccy teapot MA is lighter than a BE though which helps keep the weight less than an XUD I'd imagine.
I'm sure there are lighter engines deffo..1.8 etc...however, people always tell me how this engine is not light at all / no better blah blah...but honestly..it makes me giggle..this engine + box + all other parts, you can manhandle on your own...its like a go kart engine, XUD is fookin deadweight on the floor... I dont know what the book says / how they are meant to be similer weight, but trust me, a COMPLETE XUD ready to drop in a car is FAR heavier than a complete TU ready to drop in car...It really is simple as that in my books?!
(09-12-2014, 08:17 PM)Niall Wrote: Tbh on some cams, even with a proper map it will idle like a pig. I don't know much about these cams though so don't know how severe they are.
Heh yeah for sure, these are ph3's so far as you can go on standard pistons....which other people claim to run fine...
The only explanation I have, is that they are running verniers, and adjusting cam timing (and likely loosing power) to achieve an idle... Thats the only way I can think there doing it...
I must admit, I didnt realise the cams were making quite such a difference, it really is a different engine now...
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - welshpug - 09-12-2014
I struggle to shift a 78 kg alloy 8v xu, bollocks to lifting one, and I know the tu5 is nearer 100!
I weigh 65 mind.
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - darrenjlobb - 09-12-2014
Will stick it in the bullock weigh crate at some point if its ever out, be interesting to compare real world weights between..Infact still have the 1.6 8v that came out, so will weight that with box. I'm telling you though, its lighter, alot lighter
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - Niall - 09-12-2014
(09-12-2014, 09:01 PM)darrenjlobb Wrote:(09-12-2014, 08:17 PM)Niall Wrote: Tbh on some cams, even with a proper map it will idle like a pig. I don't know much about these cams though so don't know how severe they are.
Heh yeah for sure, these are ph3's so far as you can go on standard pistons....which other people claim to run fine...
The only explanation I have, is that they are running verniers, and adjusting cam timing (and likely loosing power) to achieve an idle... Thats the only way I can think there doing it...
I must admit, I didnt realise the cams were making quite such a difference, it really is a different engine now...
To be honest mate, without just blatantly slagging off 106owners (ok, so i kind of am), a lot on them on there, their idea of running well and idling is substantially different to most of ours. I bet a lot with PH3s in their engines on stock mapping and timing just put up with it and think it sounds more racecar when its struggling to idle.
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - Piggy - 09-12-2014
or just adjust throttle for a 1500rpm idle!?
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - darrenjlobb - 09-12-2014
(09-12-2014, 09:18 PM)Niall Wrote:(09-12-2014, 09:01 PM)darrenjlobb Wrote:(09-12-2014, 08:17 PM)Niall Wrote: Tbh on some cams, even with a proper map it will idle like a pig. I don't know much about these cams though so don't know how severe they are.
Heh yeah for sure, these are ph3's so far as you can go on standard pistons....which other people claim to run fine...
The only explanation I have, is that they are running verniers, and adjusting cam timing (and likely loosing power) to achieve an idle... Thats the only way I can think there doing it...
I must admit, I didnt realise the cams were making quite such a difference, it really is a different engine now...
To be honest mate, without just blatantly slagging off 106owners (ok, so i kind of am), a lot on them on there, their idea of running well and idling is substantially different to most of ours. I bet a lot with PH3s in their engines on stock mapping and timing just put up with it and think it sounds more racecar when its struggling to idle.
Heh, thing is I have no issue with it struggling to idle, the the issue is just the fact that it WOULDNT idle, no matter what simply no idle...lumpy / chronic idle is fine / win in my books, but no idle at all gets old fast!
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - Mattcheese31 - 09-12-2014
(09-12-2014, 09:11 PM)darrenjlobb Wrote: Will stick it in the bullock weigh crate at some point if its ever out, be interesting to compare real world weights between..Infact still have the 1.6 8v that came out, so will weight that with box. I'm telling you though, its lighter, alot lighter
don't know about the 16v 1.6 but the 8v is tiny compared to an xud9te, feels half the weight in the handling Imo
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - luke306rallye - 09-12-2014
I know Ricky P can get them to idle with newmans ph3 cams without being mapped, but he'll then get them mapped by Wayne Schofield.
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - Ruan - 09-12-2014
Yeah, that's gotta be adjusting the cam timing then to get them to idle.
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - Matt-Rallye - 10-12-2014
Just sell me the cams for my saxo and jobs a good un.
If you want reliability don't tune it.
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - darrenjlobb - 10-12-2014
What are you offering?
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - Matt-Rallye - 10-12-2014
I don't do offers fella as I tend to insult people. Best to inbox me a price and we'll haggle from there?
Ideally I was holding out for some catcam 743's but if these are the the right money...
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - darrenjlobb - 10-12-2014
Oh well if thats the case you arnt going to offer what there worth
No worries.
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - silverzx - 10-12-2014
(09-12-2014, 07:28 PM)Ruan Wrote:
That would appear to have answered that question.
Looks slow, noisy thing.
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - Matt-Rallye - 10-12-2014
(10-12-2014, 01:33 PM)darrenjlobb Wrote: Oh well if thats the case you arnt going to offer what there worth
No worries.
I dont expect them for £50p but they are second hand so surely you can be expecting the £300 that they are new?
Im not one of these derv bumboys that expect to pay nothing for top quality product. If they are worth it and i have the cash i will buy them.
Inbox is open...
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - darrenjlobb - 12-12-2014
(10-12-2014, 02:42 PM)Matt-Rallye Wrote:(10-12-2014, 01:33 PM)darrenjlobb Wrote: Oh well if thats the case you arnt going to offer what there worth
No worries.
I dont expect them for £50p but they are second hand so surely you can be expecting the £300 that they are new?
Im not one of these derv bumboys that expect to pay nothing for top quality product. If they are worth it and i have the cash i will buy them.
Inbox is open...
Like I said...make me an offer, my inbox is open also...No of course I dont expect 300 for them...
Im not a derv bumboy who wants everything for nothing either...If you took the time to read my project you will quite obviously find that....I just do most things myself to save the money I need to save to justify it... I'm not a "Derv Bumboy" whatever one of those is?!
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - Poodle - 12-12-2014
Haha the "derv bumboy" bit won't have been aimed at you Darren, it would much more likely be aimed at me!
Another vote here for mapping it, not least since the other option is pretty much to bin the project.
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - Mattcheese31 - 13-12-2014
Dervwhatboy??!!.... Someone's looking to get a can of whupass opened on them
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - Matt-Rallye - 13-12-2014
Shouldn't take things so personally! When I say derv bumboy I'm just generally taking the mick out if this whole derv mafia thing. But mainly I mean piggy tbf.
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - Piggy - 13-12-2014
Woh woh woh woh.
How am I not meant to take offence!?!?!
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - welshpug - 13-12-2014
wtf does woh mean?
calm down kids, its only the internet!
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - Mattcheese31 - 13-12-2014
i think a warning for insulting the "family" . . . . . .may be in order . .
RE: Project Daily Sigma (16V TU) - Piggy - 13-12-2014
Erm... Woh!?
As in "wooooh boy"