+- 306oc - Peugeot 306 Owners Club & Forum (https://www.306oc.co.uk/forum)
+-- Forum: Other Marques (https://www.306oc.co.uk/forum/forumdisplay.php?fid=38)
+--- Forum: Technical (https://www.306oc.co.uk/forum/forumdisplay.php?fid=40)
+--- Thread: DPF Issues... (Update page 4, March) (/showthread.php?tid=27318)
RE: DPF Issues... - welshpug - 01-11-2014
f*cking fords eh, what was wrong with a good non dpf 306 hdi?
RE: DPF Issues... - Niall - 01-11-2014
(01-11-2014, 10:06 PM)welshpug Wrote: f*cking fords eh, what was wrong with a good non dpf 306 hdi?
Doesn't meet Euro 5 emissions like it seems is so important these days!
RE: DPF Issues... - welshpug - 01-11-2014
but why is that important to tom?
RE: DPF Issues... - ConorTRG - 01-11-2014
Does your software your using show pressure before and after dpf or is it just giving you a prssure difference?
Changing to a 'dry' dpf will mean the standard ecu will still keep adding in the fluid etc so that woukd need sorting, to much hassle imo, also remapping shouldnt be working out more expensive, last dpf I put in a focus was expensive, then factor in the cost of the additive when it runs out, its expensive aswell only comes in 5L drums in fords so they charge you for how much you use of it.
Also keep an eye on your oil level and quality because if its trying to regen all the time youll end up with alot of diesel getting into the oil.
RE: DPF Issues... - Toms306 - 02-11-2014
Maybe I've gone green and started worrying about the environment Mei. :S. Plus I could give a list about what's wrong with the 306 these days lol. I also blame Peugeot for the Eolys shite, its certainly not a Ford item lol.
The Focus isn't even euro 5 btw, its still euro 4 in 2008... I'm not sure why it has a dpf tbh, tax goes on CO2 which won't be altered by a DPF afaik.
. Conor - I'm not sure, I found pressure difference but I'd assume it can do the singles as well.
Makes sense about the cDPF, could just unplug the eolys tank though, or even shove diesel in it. Not sure if you've heard of ebay? Can get 1 litre eolys kits there lol. New non gen DPFs are well under 200 quid, slightly used gen ones are 150ish. Costs more to have it gutted even before mapping lol. Then the extra insurance as well.
It us causing the oil level to rise yes, which is why it needs sorting before it kills the turbo as well...
RE: DPF Issues... - Toms306 - 03-11-2014
Checked Forscan again today...hundreds of live data logging choices...but no single pressure ones lol. Though as its only one sensor, maybe it only reads the difference rather than singles to work out the difference (if that makes sense!). Either way, does anyone know what the difference should be? Surely its on Autodata etc?
I'm starting to think maybe the sensor cant read more than 9kPa difference, which is why it peaks there every time. But without knowing what it should be, can't really go any further...
RE: DPF Issues... - Toms306 - 06-11-2014
Just fyi, asked 'Ford Parts UK' for a quote on a genuine DPF... Not quite as bad as expected tbh!
Total Cost: £776.12 (£180.00 is refundable on return of old core unit)
Don't think I'll go genuine if I do need a new one lol.
Though it does make me wonder how certain companies can sell them for a quarter of that. They're type approved as well as all replacement cats have to be for newer cars.
RE: DPF Issues... - ConorTRG - 06-11-2014
The ford stuff was different to the eolys fluid I was told but im not sure if thats right there is 2 different types that cant be mixed, ive 5L of the ford stuff I must check whats wrote on the label. I cantcheck my laptop for any info because I split tea over the other day ffs. Is 9kpa what the computer is reading at idle? Thats to high should be around that on a hard drive iirc, also have you a reading of the dpf temp sensor, and did you take the 2 pipes of the pressure sensor yet?
Also with the ign on and diag opened up is the dpf pressure sensor showing anything?
RE: DPF Issues... - Toms306 - 06-11-2014
I think the different types are age related, but both the same PSA and Ford. There's plenty of people bought Eolys from Pug on the Ford forum as its cheaper.
Lol about the laptop, that sucks.
9kPa is the peak, it doesn't go above that even under hard load - or at least it wasn't, I last checked a couple weeks back. The graphs on the other page show this. Blue line is differential pressure, pink is pre-DPF temp, yellow is rpm.
Haven't had a chance to do anything under the bonnet this week no.
Cant remember if any pressure was shown with just ign on. Will have to check.
RE: DPF Issues... - Toms306 - 07-11-2014
So did a longer test today, with interesting results!
With ignition on, engine off, there was no pressure differential reading.
Graph key -
Red - distance until DPF is full of ash (irrelevant)
Green - distance since last regen trial (note, 'trial' not completion)
Blue - DPF pressure differential
Pink - Post cat/pre DPF temp
Yellow - RPM
Purple - Fault codes caused
Light purple - Coolant temp
Orange - Speed (KPH)
Red - Torque (any idea how this read lol, or is it just guessed?
)So, nice sedate drive, mpg rising - stop at roundabout then give it some onto an uphill NSL road - DPF pressure hits around 9kPa, temp is only around 200c and the fault code is thrown up (jump in dark purple line lol). Pressure then rises to 13kPa and temp continues to rise to 500c as it tries to regen - cry as mpg dropping off lol. Though seems odd the code comes up before anything (temp/pressure) are unusually high??
![[Image: DPFlogDTC_zps2e78f56a.png]](http://s796.photobucket.com/user/Toms306_photos/media/A%20Focus/DPFlogDTC_zps2e78f56a.png.html)
Have to stop a short while later, fans running, think regen hadn't completed though. Another hard boot onto an NSL road sees it hit 16kPa (and 4444rpm lol)...
![[Image: DPFlog16kPa_zps67012169.png]](http://s796.photobucket.com/user/Toms306_photos/media/A%20Focus/DPFlog16kPa_zps67012169.png.html)
Later on, regen trial occurs but DPF temp doesn't rise so assume it was aborted, uphill in 3rd and it's hitting 13kPa again...
![[Image: DPFlogafterregenspike_zpsb42891f4.png]](http://s796.photobucket.com/user/Toms306_photos/media/A%20Focus/DPFlogafterregenspike_zpsb42891f4.png.html)
I don't understand why the code was thrown so early? But it does explain my poor motorway mpg....every time boot it, the pressure rses more than its expecting so its trying to regen!
RE: DPF Issues... - ConorTRG - 09-11-2014
Generally with the dpf temp sensor it can go up to 650 during a regen, sits around 250-300 if theres a problem with it. Also no pressure difference with the ign on is right, I have a faulty pressure sensor in a focus before that was showing a difference when it shouldn't have been, but then a sensor can go faulty in different ways.
The pressure difference seems a little high, should usually be around 9/10kpa @ 3k, have you checked the 2 wee pipes going to the pressure sensor yet?, I check them for any holes/tears, and also blow down them with an airline to make sure there not gettings blocked, there can gather black 'gunk' in them also tap the holes leading into the sensor lightly of your hand to shake out any dirt in it while your at it. Say if there was a problem with the pipe after the dpf, the sensor wouldn't be getting the correct reading. Definitely check those 2 pipes.
RE: DPF Issues... - Toms306 - 09-11-2014
I checked the pipes for splits (appeared to be none) but haven't had a chance to remove them yet. How could I test if they're blocked without an airline? Would a blast of carb cleaner through them do the same job?
RE: DPF Issues... - ConorTRG - 09-11-2014
Put a small bit of piping over them of somrtjing and blow down them, dont suck, the ends can have the gunky stuff so hence puttong somethong over it.
RE: DPF Issues... - Toms306 - 09-11-2014
Don't suck? I'm not quite that stupid!
I reckon the carb cleaner nozzle is about the right size to save putting them near my mouth though, and should just evaporate after anyway?
RE: DPF Issues... - ConorTRG - 09-11-2014
Lol, no id personally blow down them, youll not really no if there stuffed when you spray carb cleaner.
RE: DPF Issues... - Toms306 - 10-11-2014
So, the car I'd bought to not touch mechanically myself...yeah...
![[Image: IMAG4142_zps48577561.jpg]](http://s796.photobucket.com/user/Toms306_photos/media/A%20Focus/IMAG4142_zps48577561.jpg.html)
The DPF pipes were all clear. Then fully removed the sheath and checked closely for cracks or splits and they're fine. The sheath has rubbed at various points but seems to have done its job to save the pipes themselves! Also checked the sensor...tapped it on some white loo roll and nothing came out at all, so that's good as well fortunately. But it was loose and flopping around as the push clip on the back side had worked its way out, obviously I've tightened it now but could that cause any problems? I wouldn't think it'd change the pressure reading at all!
Also, the DPF appears to do its job...pre DPF pipe is black inside and post DPF its still perfectly clean! What is the odd green gunge on the top pipe though? Is it just some sort of pipe lube to get it on easier?
![[Image: IMAG4143_zps819fd23f.jpg]](http://s796.photobucket.com/user/Toms306_photos/media/A%20Focus/IMAG4143_zps819fd23f.jpg.html)
Also had a bit of a fail with the engine cover...managed to over-tighten it last time so this time the entire studs came out instead of just the nuts.
RE: DPF Issues... - Toms306 - 11-11-2014
Any opinions on a 'Dinex' DPF? Not heard of the name before but they seem to make plenty of exhaust stuff and considerably cheaper than Ford...
RE: DPF Issues... - Toms306 - 12-11-2014
Get the feeling I'm talking to myself now...
Turns out they aren't made by Dinex...the supplier made a mistake.
So does anyone know who makes the DPFs with the part number starting FDF?
RE: DPF Issues... - welshpug - 12-11-2014
yeah, you're messing about with a Ford on a peugeot forum, NOT removing the DPF or mapping it, that does not compute :p
RE: DPF Issues... - Toms306 - 12-11-2014
Its still a Peugeot engine, and Peugeots shitty additive assisted DPF.
I should've gone for the Ford 1.8 TDCi tbh...no DPF needed on that! 
However it is about 500 years old lol. And appears to come with its own set of expensive faults.IF the cheap DPF works and isn't likely to melt at the first regen or block up over a day, it's significantly cheaper and easier to do that than to gut and map mine (for me anyway!).
Not to mention it'll actually still be legal, pass future MOTs without issue and will be able to sell it when the time comes.
I'd probably then have a go at DIY cleaning the old one...when that fails, work out a poor mans way of gutting it - pair of side cutters and superglue I guess.
Getting info on them seems near impossible though. Really struggling to find info online about this exact DPF. There's lots of generic DPF info, and a lot of bullsh*t spouted by people who clearly haven't a clue lol.
Ford don't seem to want to help with regards to what the 'normal' differential pressure should be or if there was a software update that mine may have missed or anything else I should check before committing to buy a DPF from them (they don't know that I wont lol). Was just told to phone their premium rate £1/min technical centre...despite emailing the technical centre. Or I could send a letter (who writes a letter these days!?) to their tech dept in Colchester. Now I know you'll probably say it's in their interest not to tell me how to fix the car...but if its a software update, or a specific part, it'd be in their interest to sell it to me surely!
The supplier of the DPF (a major parts chain) appears to have unknowledgeable's answering their ebay questions which isn't overly helpful. Just for example, when they asked about a 'small pipe from the engine', I didn't realise they meant the ~2" one from the turbo! I was then advised another DPF was the right one....umm, you mean the one with the same part number just without the fitting kit? Yeah...thanks...
The only people that have been helpful so far was Dinex...who informed me they only make DPFs for commercial vehicles so it definitely isn't theirs advertised for a car!
RE: DPF Issues... - Toms306 - 16-11-2014
UPDATE
Well I've checked everything I can, looks like the DPF is at fault. So can someone check this over and make sure I've got everything, and that the rough procedure is right?
DPF inc fitting kit (BM Catalysts)
1 litre PAT fluid inc top up kit
Oil (Mobil Super 3000 X1 FE 5w30)
Oil filter (1109 AY genuine PSA one, identical to Ford but cheaper)
Magnetic Sump Plug and Washer (seemed useful for future)
EGR blank
Fitting looks reasonably simple as follows -
Remove engine top cover, undertray, airbox, metal boost pipe and fan cowling.
Remove sensors and pipes from DPF
Remove heatshields from DPF
Remove lower DPF to mid-pipe bolts
Remove V band clamp from turbo
Unbolt and lower the DPF through out underneath the vehicle
Place new DPF, bolt up and tighten clamp and lower bolts.
Replace heatshields, sensors and pipes
Replace fan cowling, boost pipe, airbox, undertray and top cover (unless changing oil)
Go to the rear of the car, locate additive filling plugs/clips
Clip pipe to additive tank, screw cap onto additive bottle
Hold bottle high, upside down, allow gravity to force additive into tank.
Remove bottle and pipes, replace dust covers to stop dirt getting into the tank.
Inside car with laptop and FORScan
Clear any fault codes
Do the 'Refill additive tank' procedure
Do the 'prime additive' procedure
Do the 'Reset DPF learned values' procedure
Start the engine and run it up to temp, may drive it to aid this, the do the 'static regen' procedure.
Check for fault codes
Assuming all is well, change the oil and filter (change after the regen so as not to put diesel into the fresh oil!) and also fit EGR blank at this point.
Again, anything I have missed there??
Cheers
Tom
RE: DPF Issues... - Paul_13 - 16-11-2014
Sell it?
Seems far too much hassle for my liking
RE: DPF Issues... - Jimbo - 16-11-2014
Yeah, seems like you know what too do tbh
These systems just cause endless amounts of problems, sack it off is the best advise i can give.
Not exactly enjoyable chasing faults, modern cars really do not apeal to me after working in a garage
RE: DPF Issues... - Toms306 - 16-11-2014
(16-11-2014, 05:23 PM)Paul_13 Wrote: Sell it?
Seems far too much hassle for my liking
It's not much hassle really, though it seems a long list the way I've written it. Turbo is on the front so DPF is all easy access. Additive again really easy, don't even need to jack it up for that tbh. They I get to sit in the car, comfy and warm on the laptop doing the rest.
(16-11-2014, 05:28 PM)Jimbo Wrote: Yeah, seems like you know what too do tbh
These systems just cause endless amounts of problems, sack it off is the best advise i can give.
Not exactly enjoyable chasing faults, modern cars really do not apeal to me after working in a garage
It's more an educated guess than knowing what to do tbf, don't think many people DIY it, and those that do don't seem to be on the Ford Forums lol.
I did think about complete removal but it would cost more and cause more hassle short term...only time will tell if that was wise long term though!
See I really like modern cars, no interest at all in chasing air leaks around VE pumps or welding up rust holes lol. I admit you need the right tools and diagnostics for them though...the modified ELM cable has been invaluable really, not sure I'd want a newer car if I didn't have that sort of equipment.
RE: DPF Issues... - Ruan - 18-11-2014
Meh in time I've had my V50, done 30k, changed oil on it, drove it like I stole it, wasn't massively expensive... Had one weird electrical fault, but has never shown up again...
Don't need any fancy shit, just works... I think the lesson here is simply don't get shit with DPFs...
RE: DPF Issues... - ConorTRG - 18-11-2014
Theres no need to static regen usually after fitting the new stuff Tom, the 2 nuts are probably rotting aswell, they usually need cut or chiseled of.
RE: DPF Issues... - Toms306 - 18-11-2014
(18-11-2014, 07:03 PM)Ruan Wrote: Meh in time I've had my V50, done 30k, changed oil on it, drove it like I stole it, wasn't massively expensive... Had one weird electrical fault, but has never shown up again...
Don't need any fancy shit, just works... I think the lesson here is simply don't get shit with DPFs...
Meh, bit late for that now...
Also I'm sure the Volvo has lots of fancy shit...just not a DPF lol.
Lesson really is to buy a modern petrol...but preferably before Euro 6 if you live in a hilly area.
(18-11-2014, 07:27 PM)ConorTRG Wrote: Theres no need to static regen usually after fitting the new stuff Tom, the 2 nuts are probably rotting aswell, they usually need cut or chiseled of.
Hmm, FORScan says you do need to regen so I will to be on the safe side. MPG is shocking atm anyway so its not like it'll hurt that either lol!
Have to cut rusty nuts off? This isn't a 306 ffs.
Also, thanks for the tag change lol...
Got my new present today anyway!
![[Image: IMAG4155_zpsed7031fb.jpg]](http://s796.photobucket.com/user/Toms306_photos/media/DPF%20Change/IMAG4155_zpsed7031fb.jpg.html)
Anyone know what a 'leisurely pace' is?
Could be anything from 30 to 60 surely! ![[Image: IMAG4160_zpsdd9b3cc2.jpg]](http://s796.photobucket.com/user/Toms306_photos/media/DPF%20Change/IMAG4160_zpsdd9b3cc2.jpg.html)
Also got my additive...
![[Image: IMAG4148_zps342791d3.jpg]](http://s796.photobucket.com/user/Toms306_photos/media/DPF%20Change/IMAG4148_zps342791d3.jpg.html)
RE: DPF Issues... - ConorTRG - 19-11-2014
What do you mean tag change? Nuts on that clamp are usually always in bad shape. Id to take the complete exhaust of an e60 a few weeks ago because the nuts were that bad and where impossible to get at lol
RE: DPF Issues... - Piggy - 19-11-2014
Surely its under warranty tom!?! All this for a car you recently bought and paid good money for?!
RE: DPF Issues... - Toms306 - 19-11-2014
(19-11-2014, 01:24 AM)ConorTRG Wrote: What do you mean tag change? Nuts on that clamp are usually always in bad shape. Id to take the complete exhaust of an e60 a few weeks ago because the nuts were that bad and where impossible to get at lol
Someone changed the tag line under my username lol. Irony is it was probably the person that has to fix their Omex far more than I do the Focus.
Hmm, that sucks, I hadn't expected rusty nuts. None of the exhaust bolts on the Golf were rusty and that was a few years older. Guess I'll have to cross that bridge when I come to it.
(19-11-2014, 07:19 AM)Piggy Wrote: Surely its under warranty tom!?! All this for a car you recently bought and paid good money for?!
DPFs aren't under warranty, even on a brand new car. They're a serviceable item, just a damn expensive one! The warranty really only covers the turbo tbh, it would cover any non serviceable mechanical, but for example, its unlikely a 48k gearbox will explode in reality. In hindsight, I could've bought private, but it wouldn't have saved me any money tbh.