right lads, would you say its about time a classic car mag did a buyers guide on a phase 1 306? and also recognise it as a classic car?
As I stopped buying practical classics mag due to them, keep printing the same restore articles on minis, mgbs, trumphs and mozzys, they are even doing buyers guides on Audi TTs and TVRs! Those I have to say are far to new!
They seem to forget that there are other classic cars out and up coming ones too! Ours is one of them with the phase 1! They just say did a write up on the 205, due to that hitting 30 years old.
There are great examples on here that could be used, and the info on here is just as good if not better than a proper pug work shop manual.
I was over the moon that they finally recognised the older model of mine, due to the fact one of the lads did a write up on the restoration of his. The car was restored as a tribute to his late wife as it was her 1st car.
My ph.1 gti6 is 18 years old this month. Perhaps when the gti6 hits 20 years old?
Still, yes it is what Germans would call a "young timer", aka. a young, emerging classic.
I think its very close, now they're getting rarer. I reckon now is the time to buy one, they won't get any cheaper.
(15-02-2015, 07:54 AM)THE_Liam Wrote: [ -> ]I think its very close, now they're getting rarer. I reckon now is the time to buy one, they won't get any cheaper.
Agreed. Although I'm waiting for Tom to come along, slag them off completely, saying they will drop to being worth £1.50 at best for a minter and everyone should buy a brand new focus and join his and Rowells nazi regime
Well I was keeping my opinion to myself but now you ask...
I don't think they are a classic, not sure they ever will be... Its just a mid sized family hatch, not really anything 'special' imo. It'd be like saying a mk1 Focus will become a classic in a couple of years...
They'll never drop to £1.50, the parts will be worth enough to keep them floating around £500...but only the Rallyes and '6s will hold any real value, the rest will die out through rust anyway.
Though I have been wondering what will be a 'classic' in 20 years time, seems odd to think that some of the new cars today will be classics then...
Focus RS with 5 cylinders will be at least somewhat special as it was before they went down to 4-pots I'd have thought.
Not necessarily classic, but appreciated.
Today's cars might be a total nightmare in 20-30 years with all the electronics.
(15-02-2015, 12:32 PM)RetroPug Wrote: [ -> ]Focus RS with 5 cylinders will be at least somewhat special as it was before they went down to 4-pots I'd have thought.
Not necessarily classic, but appreciated.
Today's cars might be a total nightmare in 20-30 years with all the electronics.
Yes true, and I'd say the S16 will be the same. But not a 1.6 8v ph1 for example, so you can't group ph1s as a classic imo.
Electrics aren't that bad really, I would hope they now use better insulation and loom protection than they did 20 years ago, and there's a lot less wiring to go wrong since CAN was introduced. Sensors themselves are easy to diagnose and will become cheaper as tech moves on. However, saying that, we now live in a throwaway society where it makes more financial sense to buy another car than spend a lot fixing one. Only have to look at spares repairs cars to see the daft prices people are quoted to fix chap old cars. People also need reliability now that everything is non-stop rushing, which you can have with an old car but at a massive cost and pre-empting failure points. When you could have a warranty on a new car, or even an aftermarket warranty on something up to 8 years old iirc. This means a lot of cars that would've been saved/fixed in the 90s, will now just get scrapped for something newer, so won't be many left in 20 years time. Cost cutting has also ruined cars, the little city bugs (107/C1/Aygo) will never pass 15 years old imo!
D-turbo's, gti6, s16 and walley's all heading for classic status Imo, give it five years and a lot will have disappeared, I just think the phase 1's look better every year with all the horrible so called styling we are subjected to on new cars these days
(15-02-2015, 12:44 PM)Toms306 Wrote: [ -> ] (15-02-2015, 12:32 PM)RetroPug Wrote: [ -> ]Focus RS with 5 cylinders will be at least somewhat special as it was before they went down to 4-pots I'd have thought.
Not necessarily classic, but appreciated.
Today's cars might be a total nightmare in 20-30 years with all the electronics.
Yes true, and I'd say the S16 will be the same. But not a 1.6 8v ph1 for example, so you can't group ph1s as a classic imo.
Electrics aren't that bad really, I would hope they now use better insulation and loom protection than they did 20 years ago, and there's a lot less wiring to go wrong since CAN was introduced. Sensors themselves are easy to diagnose and will become cheaper as tech moves on. However, saying that, we now live in a throwaway society where it makes more financial sense to buy another car than spend a lot fixing one. Only have to look at spares repairs cars to see the daft prices people are quoted to fix chap old cars. People also need reliability now that everything is non-stop rushing, which you can have with an old car but at a massive cost and pre-empting failure points. When you could have a warranty on a new car, or even an aftermarket warranty on something up to 8 years old iirc. This means a lot of cars that would've been saved/fixed in the 90s, will now just get scrapped for something newer, so won't be many left in 20 years time. Cost cutting has also ruined cars, the little city bugs (107/C1/Aygo) will never pass 15 years old imo!
A lot of high-end cars rolling off of production lines today have tens of separate, small ECUs/electronic control boxes.
Modern electronics are a lot more reliable, sure, but there is a vast amount more of it to go wrong.
I agree that random small-engined petrol 306s etc. won't really be considered special.
If someone had one in timewarp condition people might be interested as they remember them on the roads but they won't be cult cars.
Doesn't need to be high end, theres about 20 'modules' on the Focus. But the CANBUS means theres a lot less wiring between them. And if a module fails (very uncommon tbf) just swap it out for another.... They really aren't as complicated/scary as people seem to think imo! That said, I'd feel the same about rebuilding a VE pump lol...
(15-02-2015, 07:09 PM)Toms306 Wrote: [ -> ]Doesn't need to be high end, theres about 20 'modules' on the Focus. But the CANBUS means theres a lot less wiring between them. And if a module fails (very uncommon tbf) just swap it out for another.... They really aren't as complicated/scary as people seem to think imo! That said, I'd feel the same about rebuilding a VE pump lol...
The wiring harness is still the heaviest assembly after the engine assembly in a lot of modern vehicles.
You might be able to swap them out but imagine dealer prices for what will essentially be 20 years' obsolete computer parts!
Also, wiring has a lot less tolerance now days for deterioration and lets not start on fibre optic networks!
There is a lot to go wrong, its just different things to cars 15 years ago.
(15-02-2015, 12:21 PM)Toms306 Wrote: [ -> ]Well I was keeping my opinion to myself but now you ask...
I don't think they are a classic, not sure they ever will be... Its just a mid sized family hatch, not really anything 'special' imo. It'd be like saying a mk1 Focus will become a classic in a couple of years...
They'll never drop to £1.50, the parts will be worth enough to keep them floating around £500...but only the Rallyes and '6s will hold any real value, the rest will die out through rust anyway.
Though I have been wondering what will be a 'classic' in 20 years time, seems odd to think that some of the new cars today will be classics then...
tom are you sure about that? that the less spec or sporty spec ones will die off. As I can name a few cars that no matter what model it is, they have practically gone up in value.
The mini for instance, is one and the escorts are another one too!
The parts you will find may jump like, well the rarer bits will do.
it all depends how well the new shit is put together, and if some companies are still in business, in the last 20 years ago, we lost 3 car manufactures, Rover, Daewoo and Saab. So those cars are really going to end up on club support, of some sort to.
I know it sounds daft having a Daewoo fan base, But think the reliant, lada have their backers too.
Got to say out of the 90s generation the 306 has really lasted and is aging really well, in fact the 106 has too!
(15-02-2015, 07:14 PM)RetroPug Wrote: [ -> ] (15-02-2015, 07:09 PM)Toms306 Wrote: [ -> ]Doesn't need to be high end, theres about 20 'modules' on the Focus. But the CANBUS means theres a lot less wiring between them. And if a module fails (very uncommon tbf) just swap it out for another.... They really aren't as complicated/scary as people seem to think imo! That said, I'd feel the same about rebuilding a VE pump lol...
The wiring harness is still the heaviest assembly after the engine assembly in a lot of modern vehicles.
You might be able to swap them out but imagine dealer prices for what will essentially be 20 years' obsolete computer parts!
Price will be the problem, as I said above its cheaper to get something else than fix older cars a lot of the time. Though a lot of those sort of things are used across a range of cars so should be used ones about and should keep new prices down.
(15-02-2015, 08:56 PM)procta Wrote: [ -> ] (15-02-2015, 12:21 PM)Toms306 Wrote: [ -> ]Well I was keeping my opinion to myself but now you ask...
I don't think they are a classic, not sure they ever will be... Its just a mid sized family hatch, not really anything 'special' imo. It'd be like saying a mk1 Focus will become a classic in a couple of years...
They'll never drop to £1.50, the parts will be worth enough to keep them floating around £500...but only the Rallyes and '6s will hold any real value, the rest will die out through rust anyway.
Though I have been wondering what will be a 'classic' in 20 years time, seems odd to think that some of the new cars today will be classics then...
tom are you sure about that? that the less spec or sporty spec ones will die off. As I can name a few cars that no matter what model it is, they have practically gone up in value.
The mini for instance, is one and the escorts are another one too!
The parts you will find may jump like, well the rarer bits will do.
it all depends how well the new shit is put together, and if some companies are still in business, in the last 20 years ago, we lost 3 car manufactures, Rover, Daewoo and Saab. So those cars are really going to end up on club support, of some sort to.
I know it sounds daft having a Daewoo fan base, But think the reliant, lada have their backers too.
Got to say out of the 90s generation the 306 has really lasted and is aging really well, in fact the 106 has too!
Yeah but that's the point I'm making, some cars like minis and beetles are classic regardless of the engine, I don't the 306 will ever be that, only the 'special' 306s will become classics...but its just my opinion, none of us can read the future (no, not even the people that claim to lol).
Nobody would have said in 1968 that a Cortina 1200 Deluxe would ever be a classic, only the Lotus Cortina or GT would be classics. Now mint ones are 10 grand and up on eBay...
If anyone still has a 306 50 years after they were made then yes, of course that will have value. Will need to be someone that owns a welder, soldering iron and a massive bearing press though.
(16-02-2015, 09:22 AM)Toms306 Wrote: [ -> ]If anyone still has a 306 50 years after they were made then yes, of course that will have value. Will need to be someone that owns a welder, soldering iron and a massive bearing press though.
So basic tools for an enthusiast?
Also, can the title please be made into a vaguely coherent sentence? I can't even work out what it's meant to say
Basic tools for someone with space to store things like that.
The title isn't that bad lol, just missing a 'you' and 'is' that I can see.
(16-02-2015, 09:22 AM)Toms306 Wrote: [ -> ]If anyone still has a 306 50 years after they were made then yes, of course that will have value. Will need to be someone that owns a welder, soldering iron and a massive bearing press though.
Challenge accepted.
I'm not sure my nerves could take 32 more years of 306 ownership...
